You've got to respect anyone who manages to bag credible Top 10 hits while continuing to churn out resolutely underground bangers, and full-length albums to boot. Skream & Benga's continually prolific output and ongoing contribution to the dubstep scene has never been in doubt, and now their Magnetic Man project with one of the scene's godfathers, Artwork, is taking on a life of its own - showing the dancemusic world at large that it is possible to have your cake and eat it too.
Dubstep has grown so big that a dubstep act can now get in the Top 10 without compromising their style. OK, so we've not had a dubstep track in the charts without a vocal, but who cares when the vocals they're using are top-notch?
I digress. I Feel Air might be a bit too poppy for some, but after a listen to the debut Magnetic Man album, it's clear that this is no throwaway, cash-grabbing exercise. They've found themselves a label who are willing to back them withou
t making them water things down, and we're all the better for it. If you've heard Mad, you'll know the raw power they're capable of; if you've heard next single Perfect Stranger, you'll know they can do the anthem thing no problem. We caught up with them at London's Shoreditch House to discuss studio business, production tips, and their attitudes towards making music. . .
OK, first question - for people who are just getting started or on a budget, what should be your first purchases? What are the best things to spend your hard-earned cash on?
Benga: Erm, what did I get first? FL Studio?
Skream: I'd say a good soundcard, you can record in and get outs out of. . .
Benga: . . .'cos whatever sounds you can't make inside your computer you can make with your mouth. It's a good one I guess. What else do you need? You just need a program, you need a sequencer so you need FL Studio which is just massive and you can do so much stuff with it.
Do you all use FL Studio?
Skream: No I use it. But if you're on a tight budget then for me it's the best. I'm gonna say it 'cos I use it but it's the easiest to actually understand how to work a DAW.
Benga: No but I think it's actually the best program like for drum programming and stuff and getting in like. You don't wanna use Logic for your first go, let's put it that way.
Artwork: I would say the most important thing to buy is music, 'cos you need to be listening to so much stuff. If you're starting out making music you need to be listening to music 24 hours a day.
I was going to say, for inspiration is that all you guys do - just constantly listen to new stuff - or is it like "we need some ideas let's sit here and listen to a few new things"?
Artwork: You should just always be listening to good music, do you know what I mean? It's so important to keep listening, not just listening to your own stuff all the time.
But there's definitely been a lot of the kind of most legendary producers have been people who made music in a bubble and they don't listen to...they ignore everything else...
Benga: But they wear themselves out.
Skream: Yeah, but that's like a select few over god knows how long.
Artwork: I mean for a period if you're gonna go in and write something yeah fine, but most of the time when you're driving home or whatever or if you're sitting around at home, don't watch the telly - listen to music? You should be listening all the time.
Skream: 'Cos then the thing is, like what happened with me and Benny, you listen to stuff and you actually try and make it but you're not... you can't, and then you sort of end up with your own thing from it.
Was that the same experience for all three of you when you started making music? Were you trying to emulate something?
Artwork: Yeah definitely. When I first started out one of the most important things was I'd get a track that I loved and I'd try and recreate it. And in the process you learn so much 'cos you're listening to how he's done that and how he's done this, and you just try and copy it exactly, and in that process you'll learn so much, and you'll find your own way of getting that sorta sound - and then you just build your own sorta sound.
Following on from that, do you think when you sit down and start making tunes you should concentrate on trying to get your own sound, your own style or should you just make whatever kinda comes out naturally?
Skream: You can't get your own style or sound until you've learnt the basics, until you've built your way up 'cos you don't know what you're looking for until you find it - if that makes sense. If you try and start by looking for your own . . . I don't think it works, you need to...
I've phrased that badly, more once you've done that should you focus on, "OK I'm just going to make quite a narrow style so I kinda get my name known and my sound known" or do you think it's not so important, is it more important just to make whatever you want?
Skream: See what you're more comfortable making.
Artwork: If you're gonna be really successful you have to come up with something new. You have to come with a different sound. You do see these people that kinda do well because they sound like someone else, but then everybody knows they sound like that person.
Benga: But then you can never be as big as the person that you sound like.
Artwork: No, so you really should just try and make something different. Listen to everything else... but, yeah make something different.
Alright then let's get down to the nitty gritty, kicks and snares, talk to me. . .
Benga: Kicks and snares...I guess you've just got to find the best packs you can, because when it comes to kicks and snares there can be so much processing that you'll go round, and I guess if you just find the best recorded kicks and snares it'll help you out so much.
Skream: It'll save so much time.
Artwork: Yeah if you can get something, if you can get like a kick that sounds amazing without any EQ on it then you know you're on a winner? Rather than getting one and thinking ah well I'm guna boost the bottom end, I'm guna cut that very low end off and try and find it in and so and so. . .
. . . you're wasting more time. . .
Artwork: You waste a lot of time, yeah
Benga: And then again, sorry to cut you out, when you do EQ stuff, once you do find your way around EQ and stuff you have a sound, that's how you get your sound, mix-wise...processing.
Do you guys kinda stick to a certain number of kicks and snares do you just always go back to (what you did) or do you look at new ones all the time?
Skream: I don't I. it's whatever mood I'm in really. If I'm in a tinny mood, if I'm in a 909 mood. I think it just comes down to what you want. Like you sort of know an area in the packs that I think you know you tend to work from a bit more than others.
Moving onto bass that's something that people often say is the hardest kinda thing to master so what are your biggest challenges in that area?
Skream: Mine's still the same as level erm with levelling it out with the kick, that's always been my one. 'Cos I like a bass-heavy kick and a bass-heavy sub. So...
Benga: Get your side-chaining out!
Skream: Yeah.
So you can have a nice lot of low end in both of them?
Artwork: Yep.
When you're making you know music that does really focus onto your dance music (focusing days) specifically that's one of the lead things, is it essential to have some subs on your set up?
Artwork: Yes.
Benga: Yeah.
Skream: Oh no, oh no no no no... subs in the room? I haven't got no subs in the room - I can't work with them. I find it really hard working with them but I guess that's me, 'cos these two both do.
Benga: Yeah we're different.
Artwork: Yeah I use them.
What monitors do you all use?
Skream: I've got Dynaudios. BM1. . .
Benga/Artwork: BM6As
Artwork: Yeah I've got the same as that and some Genelec 1032As as well.
Benga: I got the same as them. . .
When you hear other people's productions and what other people... what's the most common mistakes or kinda shortcomings that you hear?
Skream: Mastering tracks themselves and limiting the fucking life out of it so when you open it up on a screen there's a block, with no peaks.
Artwork: And no dynamics. . .
Benga: It's really hard to master again after that, you can't get in. . .
Artwork: You can't master (it again).
Skream: I've had stuff I've been mastering for my label and it's been sent back and stuff gets sent back because he [the mastering engineer] knows exactly what you've used: he's like you've ultra maximised it, you've put a multiband compressor on it duh duh duh - and they know. And it's like, cool, but if it' . . .they can make it sound dynamically so much better for press. . . .
Benga: Just don't start your tune with anything on a master.
Favourite bits of kit and software please?
Benga: Ooh well to be fair I'm not telling anyone anything anymore. Nah only joking. I use, my favourite bit of kit at the moment. . .nah I can't say that. I just gotta give you an EQ. Er my favourite EQ at the moment is the Neve on my UAD card. It's one of the best things I've ever purchased, ever.
Artwork: One thing I've learnt is that the EQs on Logic are - when you get a lot of them - if you've got like 24 tracks and you've got Logic EQ's, on all of them, the bottom end is really really funny in the mix and you'll find it really hard to control what's going on. They do something down the bottom end so just switch it up, just try another one, try some different EQ's you don't have to go for. . .
Benga: It's lighter as well innit.
Artwork: Yeah you don't have to go for like the really high high, you know thousand quid EQs but if you just...
Skream: Find one you can run with well. . .
Artwork: Find one you can control easily and then use that instead, 'cos the bottom end of your mix will be a lot cleaner.
Skream: My favourite bit of kit at the moment. . .
Artwork: Kettle?
Skream: Is. . .
Benga: Oooh. . .
Skream: It's the Moog Little Phatty at the moment. I've been using it a lot at the moment as well for my bass. It's nice.
Do you guys use a lot of outboard stuff?
Skream: I've just got a couple of synths. To be honest,, I use different things for different style of tunes. I generally use the Moog when I'm going for something with a deeper sound, rather than if I'm going to do something mental I'll use a plugin, just for the different shapes/waveforms.
Again, you might not want to give too much away here but your favourite recently learned little tricks, or something that you would share?
Benga: Wow something that I'd share with the world. Erm, what would I share? 'Cos I know sharing's caring and all that. . .
Skream: Not in this game haha!
Benga: Yeah not in this game. Er, do I wanna give anything away? Does anyone else wanna give anything away?
Artwork: I'm trying to think of something useful.
The thing is at the end of the day you can give loads of stuff away but if you haven't got the tunes or haven't got the ideas. . .
Benga: I guess the biggest thing is right - and this might sound like the dumbest thing - but it's like. . .
Skream: Sorry that's censored haha!
Benga: Hah . . .get the arrangement up right. Get everything you need up and then actually start to filter what's not really necessary. . .
Skream: Just take it out like. . .
Benga: Yeah 'cos there's too much things going on in the mix. Use the most rhythmic things, and the things that add so much to like the power of the song, and the rest of it, just get rid of it.
Artwork: The most important thing is that kick and bass. Give it it's own space, d'you know what I mean? It sounds obvious but to people that probably, you know, are just getting into mixing or whatever the most important thing is finding a place. Look at it like a picture - you can see that the bass is gonna sit down there and you're gonna have your kick up there or your gonna have your kick down there and your bass a bit higher, but give them their own place to live or whatever
Benga: Mask as they call it
Artwork: Yeah yeah, exactly.
When you started collaborating or rather when you collaborate now, how does it work? Does it get crowded sometimes or is there always a specific role, how does it work?
Artwork: It's different for every record I think. It's like, you know, it's starting things together and then splitting off then someone will take it, do a bit more to it, you know move around - it doesn't matter. But one thing we kinda worked out from the start was that if one person doesn't like it, it doesn't go in. Rather than "oh well, two people like it and one person don't so that's that you know it's going to go in" - that can't happen. If one person doesn't like it, that's it.
That's when you get the split of creative differences. . .
Artwork: It's out..
Benga: Ha ha. . .
Artwork: But it's quite good, it's really good because you not only do you not have any arguments, you get a better product' 'cos you got three people that like that thing. So if you are gonna work in a group I would say that's a good way of doing it.
Quality control. . .
Artwork: Yeah.
When you made I Need Air did you have radio in mind and different dynamics to the usual club records, cos it's kinda less focused on the bottom end a bit. . .
Artwork: No not at all.
Skream: If you think about it – she [Angela Hunte] picked the tune. . .
Artwork: Yeah I mean the thing is when you've got a vocal that's as big as that is, it would have been difficult to put a massive top, mid-rangey bassline in there as well and hear all the words quite as clearly as it is, and it's a song. It is a song, it's not a. . .
That's a key element. . .
Artwork: Yeah, the key element of that record is that vocal. And you have to respect that, you know you have to with all these things and if you was making a track that was just about baselines then you wouldn't try and put a vocal in there. And it's the same. . .
Benga: How you mix, when you leave things out 'cos you know it's gonna clog up the space. . .
You've got to let it breath. . .
Benga: Yeah.
Artwork: You've gotta look at every record separately and say: "what is it in this record that is 'the thing?'" And in that thing it was the vocal.
And last thing who did the vocal on The Bug?
All: Sam Frank.
OK 'cos it didn't say on the promo version and I thought it may have been one of you guys or something. . .
Skream: No there was a rumour going out there that it was me or Benny... we started off saying it was Barry White and then I think Benny said it was me, and I think 'cos I didn't clarify and say it wasn't me it got out that everyone was saying it was me, but no it's Sam Frank.
I'll make sure people know. . .
Interview by Ben Gomori